How to Live Life on Your Own Terms (with Marni Battista)

[Dana] (00:01)
Welcome friends, whether you’re out on a walk, running errands, or relaxing at home, it’s wonderful to connect with you. Now I’m excited to have joining with us today Marni Battista. Now Marni is an entrepreneur, author, transformational coach, podcast host, and a radical truth seeker. Her Straight to the Point podcast and page-turning books drop beautiful pearls of wisdom that will not only make you laugh, but also provide life-changing stories of triumph and courage to stop letting you live and start living a life that’s beyond your wildest dreams. Marni, welcome to Phoenix and Flame.

[Marni] (00:49)
I’m so excited. Now I feel pressure to be funny, I have to drop pearls and make you laugh.

[Dana] (00:56)
That is going to happen just, you’re not even going to be trying and that is naturally going to happen, because I read your bio and I’ve got all kinds of questions for my listeners. They’re going to know right off the bat already from the description that I read of your background, number one being a radical truth seeker, and number two, Straight to the Point podcast…

[Marni] (01:04)
Okay, great.

[Dana] (01:19)
…because that is very much like what I am, I’m just kind of a straight shooter. Let’s just say it, let’s just say out loud what everybody’s thinking anyway, we might as well just say it so we can talk about it. So when I was reading your description and I ran across that, I’m like, oh my gosh, she is a sister from another mister right there. Now I wanted to point out too that you’ve appeared in the LA Times and the New Yorker. You have made appearances on the Dr. Phil show…

[Marni] (01:38)
I love it.

[Dana] (01:49)
…on air with Ryan Seacrest and Home and Family TV. And you have a new book called “Your Radical Living Challenge, Seven Questions for a Meaningful Life,” and that is going to be published in January of 2025.

[Marni] (02:04)
Yeah, actually February 5th is the official date, so I’m very excited about that.

[Dana] (02:09)
Well, that is really awesome, because it’s not January or February right now, but by the time this episode gets launched, it probably is going to be right around that time. So it’s going to be absolutely perfect for the launch of your book, it’s just going to dovetail right in there. Oh my goodness. So you have done a lot, and I’m really wondering, like, for example…

[Marni] (02:25)
Awesome.

[Dana] (02:38)
…your website, you say this is the phrase on there, it says, “if you could create your whole life any way you want it, what would it look like, and what are you waiting for?” I think there’s a lot of people out there listening that really want to kind of know, what is the answer to these questions and how do they get going along that path? But you know what, before we answer that, we’re gonna put that on delay. Before we answer that, I’m really interested in your story. In Phoenix and Flame, we talk about what were the hardships, what felt like we were on fire, what part of our life did we feel like we were in flames, and then what caused that, what did it feel like we were…

[Marni] (03:11)
Okay.

[Dana] (03:31)
…felt like we were burnt to ash, we felt like we were just sitting in an ash pile, that was it, and we didn’t know what was gonna happen, we were just sitting in our ashes. And then what was it that came about that helped you to rise out of those ashes like a phoenix? And then what did you do with that? So I’m super interested in your whole story, so just kind of start and let us know how you got to where you are right now.

[Marni] (03:35)
Yeah. Well, it’s funny, I think when you talk about flames and ashes, I think that I was really good at putting out fires, you know what I mean, there were not a lot of things that went by me, and I was a great problem solver. And I had this idea, I was married, I got divorced, I kind of redefined myself, I met my husband, I started coaching in the dating realm and created this business. And when I think back about the idea of the business, the dream of the business, it wasn’t something that came from here, like inside of me necessarily, it was a passion that I had and something that I definitely wanted to help people with. But in terms of what is your life gonna look like, or what business do you wanna build, I just was so used to asking other people, what do you think is for me, and what do you think I should do, and what is everyone else doing, and I need to prove that I’m capable and successful. And I had this marriage where I had a very successful husband, and I remember thinking, like, crap, my kids can’t have this dad who’s taking them to Greece, and I’m sitting in a one-bedroom apartment with lawn furniture, like, I gotta make some shit happen. I was a nursery school teacher, it wasn’t gonna happen. And so I just got busy, because again, I put out fires, I make shit happen.

[Dana] (05:15)
Mm.

[Marni] (05:24)
And I built this business, and by all external sources, it was successful, we were close to $2 million a year. I was like, I gotta break that ceiling, I gotta break that ceiling. And meanwhile, I felt more and more like I was pushing so hard. And by this time I was in my mid-fifties, and there are these thoughts of, how much longer do I have to do this? What is the answer, why can’t I fix this, what’s wrong with me, why is this not looking like everyone else’s business, the comparison despair and all of those things. But the thing is, I was enjoying my life, but I wasn’t doing what I love to do anymore. I had this big team, was managing people, babysitting people, if anyone’s worked in corporate I’m sure you can relate, or you had a business with a bunch of employees. And my husband, we’re living in Los Angeles, my kids had left the nest, my husband was like, I wanna get out of here, I wanna get out of here. And I was like, no, no, no, this is where my family, this is my home, I didn’t wanna deal with it, because I was just so committed to winning, like success in the traditional sense. And in February 2020, just before everyone started hoarding toilet paper, I was skiing in Canada with some friends, and I did not listen to my intuition, and I ended up going on a double black diamond, although it was a beautiful ski day and I was wearing new ski boots, so I felt kind of bad-ass and…

[Dana] (07:01)
Yes!

[Marni] (07:18)
I found myself flying through the air, and I ended up having seven fractures in my sacrum, which landed me flat on my back. And for anyone who doesn’t know what that could mean, when I would tell doctors or tell people that’s what happened to me, they’d say, oh, were you in a high-impact crash, it’s really, really hard to break your sacrum, you know?

[Dana] (07:45)
And seven different fractures, I mean, that took some doing.

[Marni] (07:48)
Seven. I landed real hard. And so that was the beginning of what ended up being about 12 weeks of not moving. Being in my bed, it was me, the remote, and I had a claw, you know, like really old people have, right, to reach, I had a claw to get stuff, because I literally…

[Dana] (08:14)
Yes, yes, I know what you… yes, yes. Uh-huh.

[Marni] (08:21)
…couldn’t move without being in pain. And yeah.

[Dana] (08:25)
For 12 weeks, let’s just pause and realize how long that is, to have to just lay there. Wow.

[Marni] (08:34)
And it was COVID, all of my kids came back, they’re mostly adults, I just remember laying there and hearing everything in my kitchen, I was in my bedroom and just, couldn’t do it, I couldn’t work, I couldn’t read, I couldn’t knit, I couldn’t sit, I couldn’t do any of these things. Obviously couldn’t exercise, I couldn’t do anything. And the doctors were like, you’re supposed to be better by now, and I couldn’t, I was still in debilitating pain and I couldn’t imagine that I would be able to walk ever again without pain. And I was desperate, so I was Googling everything, I was ordering those $29 info products kind of a thing to try and figure this out. And then finally someone recommended I talk to a guide, and he looked at me and he said, “you have broken your sacrum because that is the foundation, and you have built your foundation of your life on doing and producing, and you have completely disconnected the emotional part of yourself, and this is the universe saying it’s time to rebuild.” I had to break so that I could rebuild everything. And that was really the beginning of me, instead of looking at, why is this happening to me, why am I not getting better, to, okay, I’m going to go on an inner journey, a spiritual journey, to create that flame so that I could rise up, right? Because I didn’t know really any other way, and I was terrified of losing all the security and stability and all those things. It was like Jenga, that’s what I talk about in my book, I felt like I had this Jenga of a life, and if I pulled one thing out, then it was all gonna fall. And so I was afraid to change anything, even though I wasn’t really fulfilled.

[Dana] (10:46)
So listening to you talk, it reminds me of something else that was in your bio information and also was on your website that I checked out, and me being a psychotherapist, I was really intrigued by what you said. When you’re talking about rebuilding and looking at it from an emotional side, and the things that you’re able to help women do and help them break through, you said, this is really listen to this, listeners: “so that you inspire ambitious women to shed self-imposed limitations, nurture authenticity, and live life on their own terms.” And you said you’re adept at identifying and resolving thought and behavior patterns that thwart success in a collection of personal and professional spaces. And it sounds like you kind of did that for yourself first, you were forced to, and you kind of learned that. That is really a wow moment for people. So what was it that happened with you, that you were able to kind of move that and dovetail that into your business and helping other women wake up to… because they’re stuck, and I see those people too, they come in and they’re just stuck and they don’t know why they’re stuck and they don’t know what’s beyond it. So I was really, when I was reading about you, so interested to hear what your experience was and what you found was most profound and helpful for yourself and for your clients.

[Marni] (12:32)
Yeah, so it’s interesting. So my mom died when she was 64. And once I started on this journey, I just redecorated my house, I turned it into my dream house. When you live in a house for like 20-something years and then someone came in who’s a decorator and said, your house is pretty, but it kind of looks like a grandma house, and I was like, oh shit.

[Dana] (12:54)
Oh. No, I don’t want the grandma house!

[Marni] (12:59)
So I redecorated it, I was like, so great. And I was sitting at my new desk, my new office, and I looked outside, and my mom, I talked to a medium at one point that said that my mom was going to come to me in nature, and like butterflies and things. And I wasn’t thinking about anything in particular, but I looked out the window and I saw this butterfly. And the thought that came to me was, if I had nine more years to live, because I was like 55 at the time, is this what I want to be doing?

[Dana] (13:06)
Mm.

[Marni] (13:32)
Because I was recovering, I started on this journey and I realized that I was so afraid of change. And what I do with my clients, and what I had to do first, was I had to find what I call the essential problem. Because the problem we think we have isn’t usually the problem. Like, the problem is I can’t get internet marketing to work in my business, the problem is my husband, he helped me raise my kids, he had a career, it ended in COVID, I was like, the problem is he’s not working. The problem is all these external problems. And when I dove into that, Dana, I realized that I had made my safety and security, my home, completely external. And that the journey I then needed to go on was, how do I create home inside of myself, so that no matter where I go, no matter what the circumstances, no matter what’s happening, right, that I feel safe and that I know that I am who I am and that I’m okay. And when that hit me, because I was like, no, I don’t want to spend nine years in LA looking at the photos on my wall of my kids when they were growing up. It’s like…

[Dana] (14:35)
I get it.

[Marni] (14:54)
My daughter called my house an emotional museum, and she was like, mom, you can sell the house, we don’t need to come back to the emotional museum and visit our childhood.

[Dana] (15:06)
Oh wow. See, I can relate to that, because my three kids, they’re all older, two of them have launched and the third one’s on the way, and I’ve got pictures of all our Hilton Head Island trips and all the graduation pictures and the diplomas on the walls and all the things. I know exactly what you mean.

[Marni] (15:18)
Yeah. And for some people that’s great, but for me, I was like, what am I going to do next? And that’s really interesting, and that’s why I ended up writing this book, and how this whole relaunch of my brand started, because I was like, okay, how do I figure this out? And I went online, Dana, and I was searching “empty nest” and all these sorts of things, and all I was getting was a bunch of books about letting your kids go, I’m like, I got that, get a hobby, take up this, you know, start. And I was like, I got lots of hobbies. There was literally nothing out there for a map or a guide of how do you actually recreate, redesign, rewrite your next chapter so that you’re still living life in a way that is meaningful. Because I feel like in midlife, most people are on set-it-and-forget-it autopilot, and they’re like, I got two more years of this, I got five more years to that, and the life they imagine is only a 10% variation of the current life they have. And why are we only letting 20 and 30 year olds create and imagine and pivot? And that’s when I was like, alright, I gotta find a way, I gotta find a way to completely live life and have a whole new set of metrics about what is meaningful. And that’s when I came across the seven spiritual questions.

[Dana] (17:03)
Wow. So, and we’re going to definitely have time for those seven questions. But as I’m listening to you, I’m thinking about the women listeners right now, and I’m thinking about lots of times, and I don’t really like it that it’s this way, but it is, lots of times women have the financial insecurities that men don’t necessarily have to face as much as women. Let’s just be honest about that, I don’t like it that it’s that way…

[Marni] (17:24)
Yeah.

[Dana] (17:32)
I’m going to chafe against that, but it’s just the reality. And so how do you come alongside a woman who is trying to be courageous and possibly opening up spiritually and emotionally, mentally, wanting to see these other things in her life, but at the same time she has a legitimate concern, I wouldn’t necessarily say fear, but she has a legitimate concern, how does she…

[Marni] (17:53)
Yeah.

[Dana] (18:02)
…make that investment financially? How does she get, like you said, that you were able to build your business, you did want your husband to be the one that’s jetting off to Greece and you’re the one rocking in the rocker chair, so you apparently had some kind of decision-making ability, some skill with facing fears. But with regard to courage and finances with women, how do you help them at that crossroads of addressing the financial needs, because if you’re going to build a business it has to, but how do they do that and have the courage and at the same time address the realities of the financial insecurity?

[Marni] (18:35)
Yeah, of course, such a great question. So my experience in working with so many women is, and I was shocked when I first realized this, is that there are women who have zero financial plan, or there are women who have a financial advisor, or they’re partnered and they have a financial advisor, and maybe they even have a savings of some sort, but they don’t know, they don’t know what it means, they don’t know what they need, they don’t know what the runway is. Every single person I work with, 90% of the time we have to have a conversation with a financial planner, a financial advisor. And a lot of these women do have those people in their lives, some don’t, and we’re happy to educate and refer people, but most people have someone that are successful to a certain extent, but they don’t know what they need and they don’t know anything about that. So in every step of the process, we have to get what I call clarity, financial clarity, because you can’t create emotional safety without clarity. So really looking at what do you have, what do you need, doing all of that legwork. There is a process that can help you also look at how you’re spending your money, and is it really what you need or what you want, because I had to go through all this too, is the way you’re doing your finances based on ego, is it based on authenticity? And so in my own journey, I simplified, I changed so many things in my life.

[Dana] (20:31)
Nice.

[Marni] (20:38)
So I was able to have more financial security, do what I want without really overspending on things I used to think would make me happy, but they were just band-aids, they were like candy. And so when someone gets that financial clarity, then we can actually start talking about what can you do and what can’t you do. And for a lot of people, they have more than they realize, and they can start making other plans. For some people, they’re like, cool, let’s figure out how to make what we’re doing actually in soul alignment, so people change the way they’re showing up in their jobs, so that they’re not overworking, they start adding in other things. People who have businesses, we’ve streamlined them, changed them. So it’s really just about, you have to get that clarity in that picture, and most people are avoiding it.

[Dana] (21:45)
I see. Now, speaking of avoidance, you had mentioned a word earlier that I wrote down, that I think all of us struggle with, and if anybody says they don’t then they’re either delusional or a liar, and it is called comparison despair. And I think a lot of us have that despair when we start comparing ourselves to other people.

[Marni] (22:03)
Yes.

[Dana] (22:11)
And I’m sure there’s listeners out there, they’re looking at their lives and looking at other people, whether it’s someone else’s relationship that they wish their relationship was like that, or someone else’s physique, their physical well-being that they wish it was like that, or their business, fill in the blank, they’re seeing all these other people and feeling that despair because they’re thinking, how could I ever do that, how could I reach that, there’s so many obstacles in my way. I was really interested, I wrote that down because I was going to wrap back around to that and really hear your wisdom on, what do you have to say for people that are really struggling with that comparison despair?

[Marni] (22:51)
Yeah. Well, a couple of things. One is that when I was going through this journey, I noticed that social media was a huge trigger for me for that. And so I took an 18-month fast from all social media, it started off with 30 days, and I was like, damn, I am much happier, it was really, really interesting.

[Dana] (23:08)
Wow. That’s impressive, 18 months off of social media, that took some doing.

[Marni] (23:19)
It did. And the funniest thing, Dana, is that people were so mad at me because I wasn’t seeing their photos, and I’d say, can you just text them to me, and they’d say, I posted it on Facebook or whatever, and I’m like, okay, but I didn’t know people’s birthdays, you know. But then I realized, so this is really interesting, so I was inspired to do that by a mentor that I had been following. And then I realized, and I’ll go back to comparison despair, but…

[Dana] (23:26)
Ha ha ha! I will.

[Marni] (23:48)
And then I realized I was doing it because it became a “should,” like I always had spiritual superiority if I wasn’t on social media, I was doing it because this person was doing it. And then I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute, okay, let’s go back to me, what works for me? So how do we, and this is God bless, we need to teach our young people this, right, how do you self-regulate around social media, around comparison despair…

[Dana] (23:57)
Okay.

[Marni] (24:17)
…because it’s impossible to not do that. Plus you’re getting hammered with ads and things that are trying to tell you that you’re not skinny enough, pretty enough, especially at our age, God bless, from saggy boobs to wrinkles, I get it all. So that’s number one, and who knew there were so many products. But number two is that the metrics…

[Dana] (24:29)
Yep.

[Marni] (24:45)
…that we are comparing people on may or may not even actually be the stuff we care about, right. Because for me, those seven questions helped me redefine what success in a meaningful life was, and what I was basing all those comparisons on were rarely, if ever, around those things that actually matter, really, in the heart of your life. And when my dad died in 2019, he was, it was sort of a surprise, he was sick but it was unexpected, and he was in the hospital and half conscious and he started mumbling about his credit cards and stuff like that, and money, and I was like, that really got me to, oh God, at the end, is that what you’re worried about, your credit card bill, honestly, like he’s had an amazing life, why is he worried about that? And so that was sort of part of this whole thing of, well, that’s what most people compare, right, how much money do you have, what kind of clothes do you have, where do you live, what kind of car. And I was like, is that really what makes a meaningful life? And so when you change your framework of what you’re comparing to, it can alleviate some of that traditional comparison despair, because these seven questions are all within yourself. And so then you’re super empowered.

[Dana] (26:17)
And those seven questions are in your book, correct, that’s coming out. Because it definitely sounds like the listeners need to buy that book and go over the seven questions. Now, you said something, because I wish we had two more hours, I feel like I might even bring you back on. But you had a business, I believe, if I’m remembering, called Date with Dignity, is that one of your…

[Marni] (26:19)
They are in my book, for sure, that’s what the whole thing’s about. Yes, Dating with Dignity, yep.

[Dana] (26:48)
And I wanted to just kind of hover over that topic for just a moment, because I have talked to people, I have not had one patient in my office that had positive things to say about going back out into the dating world. Maybe they’ve had a divorce or they’re widowed or whatever, and they’re having to go back out, because it pings on all of our insecurities. And also I know people in my personal life that…

[Marni] (27:04)
Yeah, yeah.

[Dana] (27:17)
…have had to go back out into the dating world, and I’ve kind of watched them and walked alongside, was there listening to them talk about the travails and what they went through, what they experienced, and it is not for the faint of heart, and I would like to hear what your thoughts are on dating with dignity.

[Marni] (27:35)
Yeah, so the thing with Dating with Dignity is that people will come to me exactly for that reason, they’re like, I have everything else in my life, why can’t I figure this one thing out? And they’re smart, successful, mostly attractive, amazing people. And so the key is that, and people would come and they’d be like, I came for dating, but what I really got…

[Dana] (27:47)
Yes.

[Marni] (28:03)
…was self-love, self-confidence, and self-worth, right, because when you are dating in a place of pick-me, like I wanna be picked, and when you feel like everything that doesn’t work out is rejection, like you’re not enough, then you will hate dating. And so the truth is, I still help people with dating, because for me, I could do it with my eyes closed, once you get the mechanics, there is a strategy that I tell people all the time, just like building lean muscle mass, there’s a strategy, you don’t just go, oh, I guess I won’t eat, you’re like, you gotta eat this much protein, you gotta move this much, so there’s a strategy. Everyone needs to know, don’t wing it with me or someone else, don’t wing it.

[Marni] (29:04)
Most people are winging it, and that’s why you find bathroom selfie pictures, you don’t want to go out with that person, so don’t be the girl version of that photo. I’ve helped a lot of people, but I could give all of you, we could talk for another two hours, I could lay out every single strategy. If someone doesn’t have dignity, self-respect, self-love, if they don’t know their value, if they don’t understand what they’re looking for, that’s a value match, if they don’t know how to communicate, if they don’t know how to set boundaries, if they don’t know how to rule people in instead of ruling people out, if they don’t know how to be empathetic, if they don’t know how to be authentic, all those strategies, all those apps, it’s worthless, totally worthless. Once someone gets their insides whole, and they just rinse and repeat the strategy and have fun with it, it might take some time, right. But ultimately, I’m gonna get a message on Facebook from someone who’s like, oh my God, after I worked with you, and that’s amazing, right. But it’s an inside job. And that’s actually why I had clients stay with me for five, ten years, because we’d get the inside part, they’d get a guy, and then we’d start designing their life on their terms.

[Dana] (30:10)
Ha ha ha.

[Marni] (30:26)
And that’s why in the end I was like, wait, what’s the soul of my business? Yes, it’s dating, but it’s actually not. So dating is just one thing, because the other thing is, and this is really important, because a lot of dating coaches propagate this lie, once you get a guy, you’re happy, everything is perfect. And if you’ve ever been in a long-term relationship, hell no. Then you just start doing it all over again with a different lens, you have a different mirror. And so whatever it is that you want to create in your life, it’s an inside job.

[Dana] (31:02)
I love that so much, Marni, I totally agree with you on that. I remember long, long time ago when I was doing internship years ago, there was a phrase that somebody said and I never forgot, and I have forgotten a lot of things since then, I didn’t forget that: it’s, we live in our head. We do not live in a house. We do not live at an address. We live in our head.

[Marni] (31:18)
Yeah, yeah.

[Dana] (31:31)
And so whatever is in our head, everything else is going to cascade out of that. Every single thing in our life is going to cascade out of what’s in our head. And what I’m hearing you say, Marni, is that we need to get control of what’s in our head first, and in our heart as well, because I’m a holistic thinker and practitioner, and I love the whole, the spiritual, the emotional, the mental, the physical, it all intertwines and works together.

[Dana] (32:02)
So let me ask you what I have here for the website, so that my listeners can access you, because I’m certain they’re going to be like, oh my gosh, I need to hear more of what Marni has to say. So I have Institute for Living Courageously dot com, is that correct?

[Marni] (32:22)
Yes, and MarniBattista.com, and it’s easier, Courageously is a really long word to type.

[Dana] (32:25)
Okay, I’ll put both of these on the show notes, so look at both.

[Marni] (32:34)
Put that on the show notes. MarniBattista.com, it’s in development, by the time this airs it’ll be fully functional and they’ll be able to get to all of the dating, the living life on your terms, all Marni. So the book, it’ll be great.

[Dana] (32:49)
That is fantastic. Marni, I appreciate you taking your time and bringing your wisdom and your experience and your transparency to Phoenix and Flame for myself and for my listeners. Thank you so, so much.

[Marni] (33:03)
Thank you so much for having me. It’s been so fun meeting you and hanging out.

[Dana] (33:07)
Oh, this has been great. Now, listeners, I know for a fact you have heard multiple things today that you’re thinking, I know the exact person that needs to hear this, maybe it’s your best friend, maybe it’s your coworker, maybe it’s someone you just met yesterday. Take this episode, copy and paste the link in text and email, put it on your favorite social media sites, we need to grow our Phoenix and Flame community so we can know that we are not alone, we are together in this. Thank you for listening, I hope the rest of your day goes fantastically. I’m Dana on Phoenix and Flame.